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Hello everyone,
I have a question that I have not yet seen a thread for. My wife and I have been talking about learning how to do sutures for SHTF times. Does anybody out there have any ideas on how to practice this skill? I was thinking maybe pig skin, since it is kind of like human skin. Also I have noticed the kits online sell for around $150. Is dental floss a good substitute for this the string?
 

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Get butterfly strips and steri-strips, and super glue. Learn how to use those. Leave suturing to a professional.

Seriously.

If you have a wound that is serious enough to need suturing instead of one of the items above you need to find real medical help. That's why it would be a good idea to find where any Dr.s RN's or even vet's near you BOL are.
 

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I have seen enough uses of the strips and super glue to try if I had no alternative, but it's a painful way to die saving a buck if you got it wrong.
 

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While I agree that suturing is a skill. especially if you need to use multiple levels of suturing (deep ones with an absorbable material), it is something that can be practiced and can easily save a life I a doctor isn't available. You can practice on pork and chicken. The hardest thing for me was to remember how to tie the knot. "Steri strips" are great but not for deep lacerations.
 

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Deep lacerations often require internal as well as external stitches. Without antibiotics you are asking for gangrene and the loss of life or at least the loss of an appendage.
I would not hesitate to use whatever sterile equipment I had to sew up a cut that went to a muscle or maybe slightly into it - getting real iffy - but deep lacerations require drainage and antibiotics to prevent infection. (that's after they are thoroughly scrubbed out) You might be better served to use antiseptic flooding of the wound and binding so it is allowed to drain and heal naturally. Perhaps even coating it with honey and placing plastic wrap over it. (no honey in the wound but over the closed wound) That will keep it free of bacteria and prevent oxygen from getting through your dressing.
 

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This is were I learned, I just picked up a 20$ kit online

I was going to link that exact video. It is an excellent resources. Actually, everything Dr Bones does is good. He explains things very plainly and in sufficient detail that even somebody like me that has no medical inclination can understand it.
 
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Sutue KIT

I carry a suture set on me when I go to work for a decent set that will last awhile your gonna have to invest.
Needle Holders 6-9 inch variety while you can make do a decent one will save you time and frustration. These have a cross hatching pattern on the end to allow you to hold the suture needle at any angle very important that you be able to do this.
2 addison tissue forceps you need to make sure these have 3 teeth on the end two on the bottom 1 on top they are sharp for a secure hold on tissue
scalpel handle you can buy blades cheaper/less bulky than disposables but you must sterilize between procedures
1 Mayo scissors curved and straight sometimes its much easier safer and practical to use scissors instead of scalpels
2-6 Hemostats 6-9 inch variety best
2-6 Mosquito hemostats i find the 2-3 inch kind best they are curved to allow for visualization of the vessel you are trying to clamp
2 Allis clamps these are your heavy duty holders they have many blunt teeth and are able to clamp down on tissue to allow you to man handle tissue when needed
1 bandage forceps these have blunt teeth they are useful when you dont want to cause further damage but dont need the hold of addisons or allis clamps more of a nicety
Cant think of anything else that I would say is a bare necessity at the moment though I am sure there is something I am used to having but cant think of at the moment. As for supplies re loadable suture needles are a must but you can get suture in the armed and unarmed variety also some ligature would go a long way. Lots of things could be used in place of medical suture if you would like to know more pm me and ill be happy to answer your question
also you must make sure your instruments clamps especially are fully capable that is if you clamp them all the way down you shouldn't be able to see any gaps in the teeth store them in the partially clamped position 1 tooth on the ratchet. I see a lot of prepackaged laceration trays come like this its not problem in a hospital where quality instruments are immediately available but you may want to invest in this if you don't plan on raiding a hospital at the last minute.
 

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A large portion of our medical kit is veterinary.. Check local feed stores and online. I have a large animal vet I am close with and get some stuff a lot of others can't get their hands on. I grew up hog hunting with dogs and learned to sew them up when I was in Jr. High. Now it is just second nature. I have since taken a few different types of med classes so have a little real training under my belt. Although I am not legally qualified to sew a people..lol I couldn't tell you how many stitches I have done for family and a few close friends over the years. Just practice practice practice. The first time you sew on a human it will be wierd but you can do it if you need to..
 

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in an emergency use anything you have, just be aware some flosses have additives to them.

bear in mind floss probably will not decompose which makes removal more complex.. and expect nasty scaring.

use anything strong enough to do it in an emergency with no medical assistance.. fishing line, thread, anything.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15022020
writing on the difference between a low cost nylon fishing line and a commercial line that costs 13x the amount.
" There are no significant differences between the two sutures in terms of clinical findings or in the reported ease of use by the surgeons. The cost of a homemade atraumatic suture is US $0.07, which is less than one-thirtieth the cost of the commercial thread. The advantage of the commercial thread is the assurance of quality. We consider whether this quality assurance justifies the large price difference, and if the homemade suture should be recommended to surgeons in countries where the costs of surgical material often remain an obstacle for life-saving operations." - from Rwanda Suture Study Findings

human mouths tend to be pretty dirty so if possible sterilize any used floss before using it to suture. infections can kill so if you can't at the time consider very carefully the likely outcome of both actions and sanitize at the earliest possible time.

imo.

consider sanitizing / sterilizing any such material you plan on using medically if it is not air sealed. Even if it has not been in your mouth or the mouth of a fish.
 

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The antibiotics (we covered in an older thread) are a non-issue. FISH MOX FORTE 500 mg Amoxicillin - FREE SHIPPING on Every order of Fish Mox Forte Fish Antibiotic

They work. I've tested. ;)

Also, just a heads up. Even the sterile super glue intended for wound closure STINGS like a son of a #$%#! If the wound it's self, or using alcohol didn't get your attention, the super glue WILL! (I've lead an... "Adventurous" life) :D I really don't recommend the super glue idea unless it's the ONLY option. It slows healing by starving oxygen, causes worse scaring, and from the time it's applied to the time you eventually can't take it anymore and scratch it off, it itches and hurts. Part of it is how it pulls on the skin, part of it is the oxygen starvation, & part of it is just psychological I'm sure. But it's cruel and torturous!

Given any choice in the matter, I'll happily use Steri-strips. You can even get them at any local drug store cheap. And they work! I sliced through the skin between my thumb and forefinger and popped the stitches done in a military hospital four times as soon as they put them in and said. "Now open your hand and see if they hold.". NOPE. But the "Steri-strips" did. Healed up fast, didn't itch like crazy. http://www.walgreens.com/store/c/ne...ip-skin-closure-strips/ID=prod3347867-product

And I've taught my daughter well. My son-in-law just shattered the bone in his leg a week ago. Her first words were "I don't see any bones sticking out. Quit cryin like a baby." :D THAT'S MY GIRL! ;)
 

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The antibiotics (we covered in an older thread) are a non-issue. FISH MOX FORTE 500 mg Amoxicillin - FREE SHIPPING on Every order of Fish Mox Forte Fish Antibiotic

They work. I've tested. ;)

Also, just a heads up. Even the sterile super glue intended for wound closure STINGS like a son of a #$%#! If the wound it's self, or using alcohol didn't get your attention, the super glue WILL! (I've lead an... "Adventurous" life) :D I really don't recommend the super glue idea unless it's the ONLY option. It slows healing by starving oxygen, causes worse scaring, and from the time it's applied to the time you eventually can't take it anymore and scratch it off, it itches and hurts. Part of it is how it pulls on the skin, part of it is the oxygen starvation, & part of it is just psychological I'm sure. But it's cruel and torturous!

Given any choice in the matter, I'll happily use Steri-strips. You can even get them at any local drug store cheap. And they work! I sliced through the skin between my thumb and forefinger and popped the stitches done in a military hospital four times as soon as they put them in and said. "Now open your hand and see if they hold.". NOPE. But the "Steri-strips" did. Healed up fast, didn't itch like crazy. Nexcare Steri-Strip Steri-Strip Skin Closure Strips | Walgreens

And I've taught my daughter well. My son-in-law just shattered the bone in his leg a week ago. Her first words were "I don't see any bones sticking out. Quit cryin like a baby." :D THAT'S MY GIRL! ;)
I have used cheapo generic super glue and did not notice it to be overly painful, what kind did you use? Is it possible you might be allergic to some of the ingredients?
 

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I have used cheapo generic super glue and did not notice it to be overly painful, what kind did you use? Is it possible you might be allergic to some of the ingredients?
They put on the sterile kind (looked like a regular bottle of super glue, but in a white tube with black letters) in the military hospital when my stitches kept popping out (didn't really help). I tried Krazy glue one time prior to that at home and it stang like SIN! Couldn't have been happier with the Steri-strips. Quick, clean, simple, no pain!
 

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Get butterfly strips and steri-strips, and super glue. Learn how to use those. Leave suturing to a professional.

Seriously.

If you have a wound that is serious enough to need suturing instead of one of the items above you need to find real medical help. That's why it would be a good idea to find where any Dr.s RN's or even vet's near you BOL are.
Just to throw in my testimony. I had a cut on my Achilles that went through every layer of skin. After flushing it out with clean water, we put some butterfly bandages on it. Problem solved without a trip to the MD. Sutures are some times over rated.
 

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Suturing (or "stiching" as we call it in Britain) always seems a bit oldfashioned and barbaric to me, and makes my toes curl up, (i swear i'd faint if it was done to me) so why is it still used?
People have mentioned alternatives in this thread, sich as "butterfly strips" to hold together a gaping wound, so i'm surprised stitching is still used, but I'm not a medic so what the hell do i know?
PS- if we have to be stitched, can we insist to the doctor that we'd prefer butterflies or an alternative instead?
 
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