Scout Rifle viability & having realistic expectations

3196 Views 37 Replies 12 Participants Last post by AgentPickle, 15 d ago

Echo47

Discussion Starter · Apr 11, 2022

I've seen, read & listened to a ridiculous amount of information, entertainment media & thought experiments regarding conflict & life in general post-fecal matter impacting the air oscillator. While picturing myself riding across a wasteland atop my armored muscle car with an AK47 in one hand, the other holding bino's, is cool & all, it isn't realistic.
Movie & books often leave out just how improbable it is to stumble from one food & water source to another. The more likely methods for long term survival are homesteading & building a community, not running & gunning across the wilderness.
With all that being said, while i love a good AK, or Galil Ace in my case, I'm giving serious consideration to assembling something akin to Col. Cooper's Scout Rifle concept.
Without boring you with specs, ideas & whatnot, what viability do you see in the scout rifle concept? I see first & foremost practicality. I'm probably not going to spend every day in full battle rattle, but could have a fast handling bolt or lever gun with extra rounds on board all the live long day. Ammo consumption would be much more manageable & I'm familiar enough with living off land & snap-shooting coyotes to comfortably rely on the rifle as a break-contact weapon.

Penny for your thoughts?

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Kauboy

· #2 · Apr 11, 2022

Without knowing your specs, ideas, and whatnot, how can we know that such a build would benefit you?
If you see purpose in a short-ish, bolt-action .308 with forward mounted scope, go for it.

Not my cup-o-tea, but we aren't the same person.

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Echo47

Discussion Starter · #3 · Apr 11, 2022

Kauboy said:
Without knowing your specs, ideas, and whatnot, how can we know that such a build would benefit you?
If you see purpose in a short-ish, bolt-action .308 with forward mounted scope, go for it.

Not my cup-o-tea, but we aren't the same person.

I hear you, just didn't want to bore some folks who may not want to be bothered with it.

I'm looking to start with either a Rem. 700 or Tikka CTR in 308, 18-22 inch barrel in 308, with detachable mag, QD mounted LPVO with a Red dot as backup, should the scope get messed up. Looking at a lightweight chassis & quiver mounted rounds. Hope this helps!

Kauboy

· #4 · Apr 11, 2022

Echo47 said:
I hear you, just didn't want to bore some folks who may not want to be bothered with it.

I'm looking to start with either a Rem. 700 or Tikka CTR in 308, 18-22 inch barrel in 308, with detachable mag, QD mounted LPVO with a Red dot as backup, should the scope get messed up. Looking at a lightweight chassis & quiver mounted rounds. Hope this helps!

What is your area of operation where such a setup would be needed?
I approach a new firearm from the perspective of "I need a tool to fulfil a certain task I've identified. What fits the role?".
Have you started from this viewpoint, or did you start with "I'd like a gun that does these things."?

Sure, we can take the old scout rifle platitude of "the gun to have if you only had one", but that is different for everyone.
In an urban sprawl, that likely won't be a bolt gun with 5-10 rounds in the mag.
In the plains of Oklahoma or the mountains of Montana, it probably won't be an AR.

What do you anticipate as the most likely use-case for this gun? Hunting? Pest control? Defense? Multiple threat engagement?
If all of the above, you must accept that a "jack of all trades" is a master of none. There will be drawbacks. Some may be substantial depending on the situation you find yourself in when it's needed.
I don't subscribe to the "one gun to rule them all" idea. But I'm also the kind of guy who has 8 different types of hammer. So that tells you where I'm coming from. 😁

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Echo47

Discussion Starter · #5 · Apr 11, 2022

To keep things brief for new readers, I'll be moving soon out to the countryside from the city where I've been living the last few years. I'm looking for a general purpose rifle, for cutting down coyotes, taking a deer if need be, & fending off predators of the two legged variety if needed, all over acreage. I'm decent at longer ranges, but not past 600 yards reliably.
I agree, there's no "one above all" gun in any sense, but I'm looking at my coming needs & realize that a good full power rifle that's lighter, relatively low maintenance and precise option would fill those roles.
Truly a jack of all trades, master of none, but still more useful than a master of one.

Kauboy

· #6 · Apr 11, 2022

Sounds like a good option for you then.
I imagine a scout rifle fits into the role where a rancher/farmer checks their property lines from time to time on an ATV, and wants a rifle with them. (or a close approximation thereof)
If you're expecting 100yd+ shots and need hard-hitting power, while at the same time having a defensive gun around to scare off the potential vandal/trespasser, a bolt .308 makes sense.
I assume this will go along with a proper sidearm which would be better for taking care of snakes and such.

Back Pack Hack

· #7 · Apr 11, 2022

I bought my scout so I could "reach out and touch someone." Certainly not for home defense. I mounted a pistol scope on it to get the eye relief needed, angled BUIS and a bipod. 10rd mags filled with Hornady and I'm punchin' quarter-sized groups at 100 yards all day long. I love the trigger on it.... smooth as silk and breaks clean and crisp.

Echo47

Discussion Starter · #8 · Apr 11, 2022

B.P.H. What scout route did you take, as far as firearm? That sounds pretty close to what i'm envisioning.

Back Pack Hack

· #9 · Apr 11, 2022

Savage Arms Scout 11. It's out-of-production now, I believe.

Chipper

· #10 · Apr 12, 2022

Played around with the idea. Then bought a Sig Sauer Cross 308. Best rifle I've ever purchased. Awesome build quality and she's a tack driver. Love the folding stock. Doesn't care what you feed her.

wraithofroncollins

· #11 · Apr 12, 2022

I have questions and input...
1. What do you see needing a Scout Rifle for?
2. The term "Scout" means "to observe in order to obtain information or evaluate." what does being a scout have to do with your idea of community survival?
3. ... To answer your question.

Echo47 said:
Without boring you with specs, ideas & whatnot, what viability do you see in the scout rifle concept? I see first & foremost practicality. I'm probably not going to spend every day in full battle rattle, but could have a fast handling bolt or lever gun with extra rounds on board all the live long day. Ammo consumption would be much more manageable & I'm familiar enough with living off land & snap-shooting coyotes to comfortably rely on the rifle as a break-contact weapon.

Scouts/Snipers rely on a Remington 700 in .308 and they often work in a buddy team, with a second person rocking a M4/M16 and an M203 Grenade Launcher. So of course you aren't going to being rocking the full battle rattle but, again what does the Scout Role mean for your Community Support Survival Strategy..?

They engage targets outside the target's most effect range to respond and, are specially trained to do so. So I, honestly, believe the Scout Rifle concept is not good for Community defense, unless you are engaging mohawked raiders in spiked football pads for body armor, the added range would be effective for defense. Otherwise, its more a Scout Role to get in get information and get back with the information; if they have have to engage at the added range they do so to get space to break contact and the Rifle is supplemented with the Spotter's M4/M16 and M203.

4. ... My Thoughts on the Scout Rifle, if I am going to rely on a scout-rifle as a lone-wolf and not as small team. I am going for a AR10 carbine style rifle or M14 style rifle in .308 that I can use for close combat and lets me more effective at longer ranges. Terrain dictates tactics and my tactics are likely to change... I prefer operating in a small team with everyone using different role specific weapons based on mission and terrain.

I'm also an infantry veteran and, think in those terms. As Kauboy said, if it is your "cup of tea" go for it... I only want to encourage you to think about why? And, if it helps you to address getting you closer to that why?

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Back Pack Hack

· #12 · Apr 12, 2022 (Edited)

wraithofroncollins said:
....2. The term "Scout" means "to observe in order to obtain information or evaluate." ....

That's just one 'definition'. Here's another.

Jeep made a scout:

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wraithofroncollins

· #13 · Apr 12, 2022

Back Pack Hack said:
That's just one 'definition'. Here's another.

No its not a different definition...
Its the same Scout Rifle Definition I used at 1. when I asked "what you need a Scout Rifle for?"

wraithofroncollins said:
1. What do you see needing a Scout Rifle for?

Captjim_NM

· #14 · Apr 12, 2022

Back Pack Hack said:
That's just one 'definition'. Here's another.

Jeep made a scout:

That was made by International Harvester, not Jeep!

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Back Pack Hack

· #15 · Apr 12, 2022

wraithofroncollins said:
No its not a different definition...
Its the same Scout Rifle Definition I used at 1. when I asked "what you need a Scout Rifle for?"

So, 'scout' and 'scout rifle' mean the same thing?

wraithofroncollins

· #16 · Apr 12, 2022

Back Pack Hack said:
So, 'scout' and 'scout rifle' mean the same thing?

It does when you give the definition of "scout rifle" as the definition if "scout"... I am working with what you linked as a different definition for Scout. You're the one who said they were the same thing...

Check your link... If you don't believe me.

Back Pack Hack said:
That's just one 'definition'. Here's another.

Back Pack Hack

· #17 · Apr 12, 2022

wraithofroncollins said:
It does when you give the definition of "scout rifle" as the definition if "scout"... I am working with what you linked as a different definition for Scout. You're the one who said they were the same thing...

Check your link... If you don't believe me.

I'm not pickin up what you're laying down.

If I call the breakfast I made this morning "Scout bacon and eggs", does that mean my bacon and eggs must having something to do with "to observe in order to obtain information or evaluate"?

If I name my dog Scout, does he need "to observe in order to obtain information or evaluate."?

Kauboy

· #18 · Apr 12, 2022

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wraithofroncollins

· #19 · Apr 12, 2022

Back Pack Hack said:
I'm not pickin up what you're laying down.

If I call the breakfast I made this morning "Scout bacon and eggs", does that mean my bacon and eggs must having something to do with "to observe in order to obtain information or evaluate"?

If I name my dog Scout, does he need "to observe in order to obtain information or evaluate."?

But you gave the definition of Scout as the definition of Scout Rifle... That is how you chose to define the word "Scout." Now you are trying to back track and "move the goal post" because you defined Scout as "Scout Rifle."

As for me, I was discussing the Original Poster;

Echo47 said:
I'm giving serious consideration to assembling something akin to Col. Cooper's Scout Rifle concept.

Penny for your thoughts?

So my comments concerning a Scout as I defined and Col. Cooper's concept all related to a Scout's role to "to observe in order to obtain information or evaluate" was one I selected from Dictionary by Merriam-Webster: America's most-trusted online dictionary and my link was to Definition of SCOUT offering plenty of alternative definitions for the Original Poster to select to clarify their vision of why they need the Scout Rifle concept.

As for your Dog you can name what you like, you name International Harvester a Jeep... lol

Back Pack Hack

· #20 · Apr 12, 2022

wraithofroncollins said:
But you gave the definition of Scout as the definition of Scout Rifle... That is how you chose to define the word "Scout." Now you are trying to back track and "move the goal post" because you defined Scout as "Scout Rifle."

As for me, I was discussing the Original Poster;

So my comments concerning a Scout as I defined and Col. Cooper's concept all related to a Scout's role to "to observe in order to obtain information or evaluate" was one I selected from Dictionary by Merriam-Webster: America's most-trusted online dictionary and my link was to Definition of SCOUT offering plenty of alternative definitions for the Original Poster to select to clarify their vision of why they need the Scout Rifle concept.

As for your Dog you can name what you like, you name International Harvester a Jeep... lol

You implied that, by the definition of 'scout' that you provided, it can't apply to a rifle.

Who's backtracking now?

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