Prepper Forum / Survivalist Forum banner

1 - 20 of 43 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
8 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
When prepping comes to mind most forget about our precious trees, its a resource that should take a note of consideration. Just as food, water and other resources our forest need to be used with conservation in mind, yes its a renewable resource although its a rather long process as we all know.

What kind of rotation is good for you?
How much wood is needed for fuel?
How much wood is needed for shelter or building material?
Should you pick one neck of the woods to gather wood for fuel or shelter?
What stands of trees attract game and wildlife?

There are literally hundreds of questions that could be asked, although only one question needs be asked, how well do you know your forest?

It would be awesome to start a general conversation on the subject and I would be more than glad to answer any questions if possible. Lets spread the word to save our forest.

"The vast possibilities of our great future will become realities only if we make ourselves responsible for that future". Gifford Pinchot.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
640 Posts
Sorry... I can't see my forest for the trees. :)

A better question: How many of your semi-prepared wannabe prepper neighbors are going to head to your woods when SHTF and how much of your forest will they destroy before you can shoot them all?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Rogue_Scout

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,829 Posts
I have a few questions if you don't mind?

1. How long would chopped wood last in normal climate uncovered? Would it last longer if it was just cut into 2 foot logs, but not chopped?
2. What type of trees would be good to block out certain things (Sound, Visual) to provide a safe haven for a retreat?
3. How much chopped wood would you consider (Ricks) having if you wanted to survive a full winter heating a 2000 square foot cabin?
4. Speaking of cabins, what would you consider being the best outside protectant from elements?

Welcome to the forum! Oh, and "I think that I shall never see, A poem as lovely as a tree. A tree whose hungry mouth is prest, against the earth's sweet flowing breast. A tree that looks at God all day, and lifts her leafy arms to pray. A tree that may in Summer wear, a nest of robins in her hair. Upon whose bosom snow has lain, who intimately lives with rain. Poems are made by fools like me, but only God can make a Tree. ~Joyce Kilmer

BTW, are you a forester?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
21,643 Posts
Hybrid popular. They grow 40 feet in 5 years when started from root stock if you do a bit of clipping they grow taller quicker and more like other trees. When you cut them they are often good to burn as is no real slitting to do.
They may not burn a long as oak but makes managing a wood supply easy and save a lot of work.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
640 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
21,643 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
8 Posts
Discussion Starter #8 (Edited)
Damage or destruction is a definite consideration and cause for concern. A forest can offer tons of protection not only from the unwanted world but also unwanted intruders, I like to think of it as a buffer. To WoadWarrior, what kind of damage are you thinking of? Several pine forest (especially longleaf pine/Pinus Palustris) are fired adapted, if someone were to set ablaze to said woods it would almost be an unintended act of kindness. This isint true of many other tree species though, although some trees have a higher resistance to high temperatures than others. Many Native American tribes actually set fire to many of their forest because they saw the correlation between fire and healthy regeneration.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
To survival, let me awnser your questions to the best of my ability. let me start with the forester question, no I'm not. In NC you have to have at least a 4 year degree to legally call yourself a forester and that I do not have, although I am currently working towards that goal, I will have my two year degree in just one more semester, then off to Oregon to get that bachelors and become a certified Forester and arborist.

1. I really don't want to be that guy who is really vague in everything but a lot does depend on what part of the world you reside. Here in the coastal plains where we get average rain fall with tons of humidity we can assume ( I hate that word) the process of decomposition would be accelerated. If a proper building is made to store your fire wood perhaps like an open sided shed with the wood raised off the ground and kept dry it could keep for 10-20 years if never touched this also depends of species and how well everything is covered. Logs are going to keep much longer than split wood for a few reasons, split wood has more surface area which allows more moister or even pest and insects to get inside. I recommend to keep logs and split as needed.
2. Again this also depends on your location, and what you consider to be aesthetic or practical. Soil types and site index are a few other things to consider, even though there may be a desired species to be planted it may not like the location or the soil type and never grow to desired DBH (diameter at breast height) or size. With a little info I can make better recommendations based on region and altitude. Although here ceders come to mind, the juniper tree has a pretty good growth rate and fills out rather nice making a nice audio/visual screen from the undesired.
3. I would start with at least a cord of wood 4'x4'x8' is the dimensions which is 1536 board feet, that should be a good basis to build on. Depending on how cold it is and your threshold of cold temperatures, heavy use would go about 3 weeks or so but with rationing I reckon it could be pushed to 4-5 weeks. This should help you plan out how much fuel its going to take to make it through a winter. Here I could very easily get away with a cord of wood considering we uselessly have very mild winters.
4. Perhaps this is only opinion but I would go with a resinous tree, something with lots of sap. Soft wood can be a confusing word it doesn't necessarily mean the wood is less dense than another. Log cabins can be built with a variety of tree species and no one is necessarily better than another. Several factors, including environmental conditions, structural requirements, homeowner preference, availability and cost of course, often combine to create a shortlist of most commonly used species. Douglas fir, engelmann spruce, hemlock, larch, lodgepole pine, ponderosa pine and western red cedar. I think pine would be the best choice, they tend to have more commercial logs and tend to be straighter and more uniform which would make it easier to stack. Not to mention a few products you can obtain just from cutting pine even stuff to help build said cabin.

"The vast possibilities of our great future will become realities only if we make ourselves responsible for that future". Gifford Pinchot.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
640 Posts
To WoadWarrior, what kind of damage are you thinking of?
I was thinking more in line with.... make a ton of noise and scare off game I need to survive... indescriminately cut down trees for firewood and leave debris everywhere... and possibly create unnecessary erosion... trample all of the edible plants.... leave trash all over... piss in or put trash in my drinking water stream. A forest may survive a forest fire but that sort of chases me and all of my game away as well.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
Oak is good, be it red, white, black or pin. Cut out the weak, let the strong grow
Basic silviculture, eliminate competition and undesired species allows desired species to grow and improve site index. I would recommend a overall lite thinning to remove undesired species and start with those for fuel and heat. Although some consideration is to be taken, its always better to have a stand of mixed species, mono-cultures rarely do well without intense management, just think about your lawn. Side thought here, did you know that here in the pine forest of the Green Swamp of NC is considered to be one of the most ecologically diverse places in the world even more so than the rainforest of south America? I should say this could be slightly misleading, this is only true in a meter by meter area, over a much, much larger scale the rainforest is more diverse.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,829 Posts
Mr. Pine Tree, Awesome! Thank you for that info. I have been assuming a log would be better kept than split, but wanted to hear an expert on the subject. My sister just recently went to do her internship at NC in forestry and is now back in Kentucky. My father, who is way up in the Office of Surface Mining arena has always pushed me in this direction as well. I can't seem to get squat out of questions from him though. We all own log cabins and one of the biggest issues that I'm facing right now is what to seal the outter logs with. I've bought some stuff from Permachink which is supposed to prevent rot, mildew, insects etc. That will be my summer project on the application of a protectant like this described. They also sell a "fire retardant" chemical that you can apply to the exterior logs, which in a SHTF situation, would be very beneficial. I'm still thinking about that project though.

In regards to cover of protection for my area, I'm leaning towards keeping trees, while others might disagree with a good barrier to be gone so they can see someone coming, I consider the lesser of two evils.

  1. I can use the trees for fuel in the winter.
  2. I can string tons of barb wire throughout the entrances of my forest, which will slow down any type of tresspassers.
  3. Providing a habitat for wildlife such as squirels, deer, birds, turkey etc.
  4. Trees would be for range detection (200 yards to the maple on the South corner).
  5. Deadfalls traps for game.
  6. Providing cover of my retreat.
  7. Providing a means to put up a HF antenna in the treetops.
  8. Furniture can be made with the wood.
  9. Logs used for smoking food can be accomplished.
  10. Makeshift arrows and bows.
  11. Forests grow wonderful mushrooms.
  12. Pulp for toliet paper, might be complex, but could be done.
  13. You can eat bark.

So yes, I'll keep my trees for now. The only benefit I see of not keeping them around is for seeing someone coming, which #2 can at least slow them down. If you cut the trees, then you'll still need someone on watch to see them coming, so stringing up barb wire in different directions, setting traps and noise makers might help.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8 Posts
Discussion Starter #13
Established lines and boundaries should be implemented, as for myself I'm going to be in the woods everyday checking for tracks and evidence of unwanted things or persons. A larger area would be difficult to patrol and maintain, perhaps a system of quadrants could be used and areas designated to certain individuals. As far as water goes I can't really think of many places where the water is clean enough to drink straight from the source and we all know boiling is recommended for at least 30 mins. Certain animals are attracted to certain areas because of herbaceous plants and tree species, some birds only nest in specific tree species and will only leave if their home is destroyed. What I'm getting at is if you have a healthy stand of trees the animals are going to come back if scared off because they much like us know how to take advantage of good resources. I know a few people that manage their land only to attract desired species of game, and is actually very successful in attracting what they want. Another advantage of fire is the clearing effect, although I have seen many a deer here in our procosson forest which are 'extremely' thick and dense they do prefer a slightly more open environment. Prescribed fires are very common here and are geared towards regenerating forest land and bring in desired game animals. As for people taking whats yours you just gotta catch em in the act and shot as needed.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,829 Posts
The log bin with a total of 4 metal fence posts. I'm going to keep them as "logs" and not split them like you mentioned. less work right now. I have one finished, will work on 3 more ricks.

Split wood.jpg
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,829 Posts
I don't know if you can see these that good (camera phone), but could anyone identify this type of pine? Its very long and slender. I'm in SE Kentucky area if you need that to id. I've been told its a western pine?

pine (2).jpg
pine (3).jpg
pine.jpg
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
Although you may not be able to see people coming those people are going to have a hard time to see you, perhaps they'll stumble upon you and then you'll have the advantage. I would say the benefits of a forest outweigh the sight advantage of an open plain. Fuel, food, forest products and materials, not to mention improved air and water quality, wind breaks which help prevent soil erosion, promote a healthy ecosystem and attract game or desired species of animals. I know I'm going to have more traps, snares, dead falls and pits than anybody should ever be comfortable with, anyone would be hard pressed to make it through my labyrinth. The list you provided is pretty impressive although to me it could be an endless list of pros and I would be hard pressed to argue as to why you should not have adequate protection from our forest. Forest have protected man for thousands of years and I'm sure it can do the same for many more.

"The vast possibilities of our great future will become realities only if we make ourselves responsible for that future". Gifford Pinchot.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8 Posts
Discussion Starter #17
how many needles per fascicle? If you get a close shot of the leafs and the bark I can id it. although it does appear to be a western pine given the region.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
21,643 Posts
One of Hybrid Popular stands trees are 4-6 years old well spaced to allow the area to be use for sheep /goats if we want. It is also used as a shooting range. Mixed in are some White Oaks, Maple and Ash for long term use. The Hybrids help to protect the other Hard woods when they are smaller.
Advantages are many you can plant the closer to where you will need the wood. Less hauling. Depending on how you manage yours you can cut them at a time when darn little splitting will be needed again saves time and energy less wear on tools.
If you start yours from root stock first year they need water once they root in good they are very hardy.
The can be own from small cuttings. We treat then like any crop grow them harvest replace.
The edge of the creek is also lined with some This is picture was taken today so season change is well underway. Area between the creek and this stand is marsh grass for feed and bedding. Also a good home for small game.
The deer will at times stand there and watch you make wood so wild life is not an issue they will seek up cover ,food and water Bit of history that are was once all big Oar and elm with a few ash. Long before my day. It was cleared in the 30-40's the wood was used to build barns and for heat it was the pasture land for many years. It sure helps when you know some of the history of the land.

 
  • Like
Reactions: survival

·
Registered
Joined
·
245 Posts
Mr.PineTree and I have a different plan than most of you. We are setting up an ecovillage/Prepper community, so our neighbors won't be a problem as they won't exist. Our place will be nestled deep in the woods with little to no chance of being stumbled upon even in a SHTF scenario. Unlike other ecovillages, we hope to be completely self sufficient soon after our 2nd or 3rd year so there shouldn't be a problem with people knowing where we are.

That being said, I have extensive training with animals so even if we were stumbled upon they would first have to deal with our alarm system, and second with our 4 legged security. Our ecovillage will provide a wonderful community service before SHTF by educating the public on ecological matters, but that ecovillage will quickly turn into a well fortified prepper station when things go bad.

@SURVIVAL, Told 'ya he was smart didn't I? lol.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
245 Posts
The log bin with a total of 4 metal fence posts. I'm going to keep them as "logs" and not split them like you mentioned. less work right now. I have one finished, will work on 3 more ricks.

View attachment 796
Don't forget to separate your ricks. You don't want a natural disaster taking all your wood out at once. Make it hard on mother nature and wood thieves by spreading them out around your property.
 
1 - 20 of 43 Posts
Top