[Kauboy]

Apparently 6 of the little turds they arrested were carrying explosives. Things could get interesting.

The only explosives I saw were fireworks.
Technically, yes... effectively... no.

 

[Kauboy]

A cop friend of the family said they don't chase speeders anymore. Unless they're an obviously danger to other drivers such as intentional collisions or drunk, it's just not worth the risk and hassle anymore. All of his fellow officers do this.
He said he doesn't feel like he's a good cop anymore.
I'm sure he's looking for sympathy, but he didn't get much from me.
You're either "law enforcement" or you're a bench warmer waiting for your pension to vest.
I only have respect for one of those.
If you don't feel you can do the job, find a different job.

 

[Kauboy]

In fairness to your cop friend, was it his decision to not chase speeders or was it his department policy?
I'm a retired 2nd. generation cop (State Police Sergeant) When I started we had three policies: Obey the law, Enforce the law, Don't do anything to discredit the Department. By the time I retired the Policy and Procedures manual filled fourteen 2" binders.

He never mentioned it was stated department policy.

I knew hundreds of cops over the decades, I never knew one who wasn't ready to enforce the law.
...but what about the cop who's 2 years from retirement, too old to start another carrier, has a department mandated camera strapped to his chest, 2 cameras in his unit, a dozen screaming pink haired freaks pointing cellphone cameras at him, a crowd of "journalist" and a 'catch and release' DA just waiting for him to get in a pursuit, against policy, with an LGBTQEIEIO transgender person of color over a petty misdemeanor speeding violation?

In my opinion, he's either a cop or he's not. Distance from retirement does not adjust the job expectations.

 

[Kauboy]

Pursuits are very serious things, they pose more risks to innocent bystanders, by far, than any other police action. You're friend's department may be the exception, but I don't know of any department today that still allows pursuits for petty misdemeanor traffic violations.


If the driver isn't currently posing a danger to anyone, the last thing you want to do is force him to drive like a murderous jackass through hundreds of innocent bystanders. There are safer ways to catch the guy ...there's an old cop saying: "you might outrun my Chevy but you'll never outrun my Motorola" (back in the day all police radios were Motorola)


Remember we're talking about a petty misdemeanor traffic violation , the exact same violation everyone of us commits everyday. We're not talking about 'real' police duties.

You're saying that you'd willing to potentially throw away an 18 year investment in your life, your career, your income for the rest of your life, your house and the lifestyle you planned to live in your golden years just to catch someone who's committed the same petty violation you committed a dozen times on the way to the doughnut shop this morning?

You can refer to it as petty, but the reality of the situation is, the officers are doing less enforcement of the law than they previously were. That's a bad precedent.
No, I would not be willing to do it. That's why I'm not a cop. That's why he shouldn't be a cop either.
When you agree to do a job, and you refuse to do that job, you should find a different job.
And no, I'm not going 20+ miles over the speed limit multiple times a day. They don't chase ANY speeder. 5 miles over, or 40.

I'm not taking an anti-cop position here. Your history will bias your view of what I'm saying. I'm being as objective to the situation as I can be.
If a person cannot fulfill the duties of their civil service role, they should not simply be able to ignore their public duty. They should accept that the job changed, and they are no longer suited to it.
Yes, that can mean sacrifice.

 

[Kauboy]

Imagine if you will, you've worked a lifetime doing your job. The rules get changed, you are close to retirement, and you quit on principle. Now you're too old to get another job, you can't pay your mortgage or taxes, buying food and medication is becoming harder. No, I can't fault what they do. And regardless of what the law says, many employers frown on hiring older folks.

Now imagine the job you took was literally to put yourself in harm's way to create a more peaceful society... and you chose not to, but still take the paycheck.

Do whatever you can live with. I will still judge a man on his principles and actions, not his intentions.

 

[Kauboy]

In reality, I doubt that our two arguments are very far apart.


It's not my opinion, it's the legal term for the only class of violation lower than a misdemeanor.


I never met an Officer who didn't want to do his job but their hands were tied by weak DA's, liberal city counsels and state legislators and weak department policies.


No one said anything about going 20 over (that's getting into careless driving or maybe even reckless driving) You just said "chase speeders', speeding means going faster than the posted speed limit. ALL of us have gone faster than the posted speed limit at some point.


That's almost certainly true and I would argue that your lack of history (with this subject) gives you a biased, idealistic view of realities of law enforcement.

I didn't provide the whole conversation in detail. But if you'd like more information, yes, he explicitly stated that they don't chase anyone, regardless of speed, unless they are showing impaired driving or are an active danger to other drivers. This leads to the officer's discretion coming into play. Each may respond differently. But his position was that none of his fellow officers pursue speeders any longer.
Driving in excess of 10% faster than the posted speed limit is a misdemeanor in Texas, not a petty offense. You may not have known where I'm from, or our laws, so no real harm in this misunderstanding.
I do not have an idealistic view of police. As I said, I'm applying this objectively, and apply it the same across all job roles. If a person will not fulfill the role for which they were hired, they should find a different job.

 

[Kauboy]

Potato, Potahto. Texas calls a minor traffic violation a Class C Misdemeanor, New Mexico calls them a Petty Misdemeanor.

My last comment on the subject(I hope): your friend doesn't get into a pursuit (insanely dangerous) unless there's an obvious/active danger to others. He sounds like a wise and prudent officer who's willing to stand in harm way when others are in danger but he's not willing to create the danger himself over a simple traffic violation.

People have always driven fast, and it's always been responded to with a pursuit to stop the person breaking the law.
The violation hasn't changed.
The danger hasn't changed.
Our enforcement of laws has changed......
To the degree that this change is institutional or officer-driven would vary by department.

I'll stand by my position that if someone is unwilling to fulfill the role they were hired to do, they should find a different line of work.

 

[Kauboy]

Are you confusing a pursuit with a traffic stop? A pursuit is when cops have to chase some jackass until he t-bones an innocent motorist at an intersection or wraps himself around a phone pole. A pursuit is a big deal. It requires a mountain of paperwork and, almost always, involves a use of force review because someone, almost always, gets hurt or killed.

There is no confusion, though you may wish to create some.
I'm using the literal definition of "pursuit".
"the action of following or pursuing someone or something."
You can continue to enjoy using whatever vernacular you wish, but I'm going to stick with layman terms.

The fact stands, they are not pursuing speeding drivers if that is the only witnessed illegal activity.

 

[Kauboy]

Your just being silly now. I'm done.

You're trying to turn this into a discussion about vocabulary in an attempt to make me sound uninformed.
I'm conveying a message and an opinion using simple terms. I'm not confusing anything about it.

 

[Kauboy]

After a number of innocent people, including women and children, were killed by drivers evading high speed pursuits, new rules governing pursuits were established by our local agencies in the interest of public safety.

I have two step sons who are law enforcement officers. We love the police in our house.

I can seek clarification, but the way it was conveyed to me was that the decision was per officer, not per department.
I don't expect anyone to go beyond what their department allows/advises.