Prepper Forum / Survivalist Forum banner

1 - 20 of 46 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,797 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Well my vacations ending early it seems, luckily my trip went better than planned and I got back in town a couple days early...

Apparently one of the guys at my work had and "Accidental Discharge" and ended up shooting himself in the leg. Fortunately he is going to live but the damage to his leg was pretty severe. He managed to miss the artery so he didnt bleed to death before he could get some help, but the bullet did shatter his femor (sp?) bone in his thigh and its expected to be about 4 months before he can stand again. Not sure of the caliber in question the hand gun was chambered for or every last little detail of the incident in question was but...

How in the hell do you have an Accidental Discharge?

In my opinion there aint nothing accidental about it. Accidents dont just happen they are created about 99% of the time. In 21 years of service as a weapons tech in the military who had the pleasure of investigating a number of "explosive mishaps" I dont think I once investigated a mishap that there werent a number of safety and or procedural steps that were violated. Sometimes they were through ignorance and due to a lack of training and others were lack of attention to detail, none were truely an accident!

1. The first question I have is why did knumb nuts have his handgun out of his holster anyways unless there was a threat that needed to be addressed. The guys a security guard at a retirement home and there is more action going on at the funeral home than there is there at 0110 in the morning. Just saying. That was mistake number 1.

2. The second mistake...was why did homey have the muzzle pointed in an unsafe direction? One of the first things of gun safety you should have been taught is all guns are loaded until other wise proven and you dont point them at ANYTHING you do not want to DESTROY, MAIM or KILL!

3. The third mistake was...If you were going to be an idiot and pull a loaded gun out of the holster, why was the safety off!!!

4. The forth mistake was...Unless you were about to shoot it why was your finger inside the trigger guard in the first place if you werent intending to discharge the gun in the first place?

5. The next mistake is...If you were going to play with your gun while on duty (or off for that matter) why didnt you first clear the gun so that crap like this didnt happen in the first place. Yeah I know that sounds too much like right. I like to carress and fondle my guns too but I aint stupid!!!

I really aint put much thought into this rant but just using my simple arithmatic off the top of my head, thats 5 cardinal rules of guns you just dont ignore. Adhereing to any one of those rules and this so called "Accidental Discharge" probably wouldnt have happened. And as you can see not just one of these rules being violated lead up to this incident. No there were several examples of blantant disregard that occured here before disaster struck! Hence my opinion that this was no accident at all. Unintentional perhaps as I dont know anyone that wants to shoot themselves with thier own gun, but this is not something I would consider to be an accident by any stretch of the imagination. Several deliberate actions occured that took effort before the hammer dropped on this nail.

Anyone care to disagree with me? What are everyone elses thoughts on this subject?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,373 Posts
We had a guy on our gun forum last year got his "accident" filmed for the good of youtube. He showed all. I don't know why - it made him look the fool. Not sure the actual shooting was on there - I never looked. I don't disagree with you at all, and no I've never had an accidental discharge though I did have my duty weapon fall from my holster in a tough fight one time, and I could tell instantly and made it the sole focus of my next movement. It did scare me that it could fall out - went shopping next day for a new holster.

I recall my old instructor (who just passed recently and who I replaced) at the police academy telling us he wouldn't shed a tear for us if we died in the line of duty. He said 90% of all cops that go down likely did something wrong that if they had not done would have saved their lives. Police officers get complacent, the start cutting corners and forget their safety measures all too often.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
14 Posts
Blackhawk Serpa holster? they have a knack for blowing peoples legs off. Took a class a few years back and the instructor asked everyone before we started if they had one. the one guy that did was asked to find another or leave the class. Slim chance same thing happened here, but thought id throw it out there.
 

·
Moderator
Joined
·
8,976 Posts
We are all human and subject to human failings. While I agree with you that an accidental discharge is 99.9% + the result of not following standard safety practices, we all make stupid mistrakes.. So what was he doing when the accident happened?
 

·
Administrator
Joined
·
14,693 Posts
I was always told there was no such thing as an accidental discharge. There are, however, negligent discharges.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
634 Posts
That is my biggest paranoia with Guns, I tend to double and triple check when handling them. I think that is one of the easest things you can avoid happening.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,417 Posts
No such thing as an accidental discharge, only a negligent discharge. The ATF "agent" in the video, is a perfect example why affirmative action is a bad bad idea.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,423 Posts
I have been using firearms since I was 8. I have been carrying one for duty purposes since 1990. I have never had an unintended discharge. We did have an officer blow away his coffee table though. He now works for Wastewater. :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
436 Posts
Actually there are some cases of real accidental discharges and the one I had years ago is an example. I was shooting clays and had the shot gun a side by side 20 ga. that I had been shooting for about 30 minutes without problems suddenly had the firing pins lock open. I load two new rounds and closed the gun which then went off. I was pointing the gun down range so no one was injured or even close but the gun got put up and wasn't fired again until the problem was fixed. I also had a guy (and off duty cop) in the next lane had a glock go full auto on him after one shot. He put 18 rounds through the roof of the building before it ran out of ammo. The reason as near as we could figure was a piece of the pin broke off and lodged between the slide in just the right position to cause a slide fire. He wasn't prepared for it and hence the gun which he controlled worked it way up ending in a few holes in the ceiling.

Now the cop in the video I've seen before and appears that he had his finger in on the trigger putting the gun in the holster but really just a guess based on what I saw in the video. Guns are machines and are subject to breaking from safeties failing to parts breaking at any moment. With that said people don't get hurt if you don't aim them in the wrong direction or have laps in memory about safe handling techniques.
 

·
Mod Squad
Joined
·
2,260 Posts
Our cav armorer was showing us how the muzzle safety on a 1911 works, "If you push on the muzzle like this, the gun can't discharge. BANG!"

Blew a hole through his hand. Why was he showing this with a fully loaded weapon? Because stupid is as stupid does. This was over 30 years ago and I still laugh about it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
436 Posts
One other thing I will add. A statement by Clint Eastwood on the current copy of the movie of The Outlaw Josey Wales. One of the additional segments was Eastwood himself talking about a movie made years before and why the gun used had a cartridge conversion kit when they didn't exist till 3 years after the period the picture was shot in. Well when he went to Italy and started making the string of spaghetti westerns one of the Armour on the first movie was showing the cast how to load and shot a cap and ball, civil war era hand gun. Well he didn't cover the ball with grease as needs to be done and got a chain fire. It scared Eastwood so bad he insisted on a cartridge conversion for every civil war gun from that moment on. Now one was hurt but the gun came apart. Now that was a mistake on a "expert" gun handler that wasn't paying attention and not an accident in my opinion but stupidity in this case.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,797 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
We are all human and subject to human failings. While I agree with you that an accidental discharge is 99.9% + the result of not following standard safety practices, we all make stupid mistrakes.. So what was he doing when the accident happened?
Apparently he was in the office area chillin' after completing a round through the nursing home and was happy jacking around with his gun. Peliminary investigation revels there was no malfunction of the gun and that it worked as advertised the way it was designed to when its loaded and you take the safety off and pull the trigger! That tells me right off the bat that there were a lot of things going on that had no business happening in that environment or situation. Hence my lack of understanding and sympathy. Granted I understand we are human and we make mistakes if we did not then I could walk on water without it first being frozen! The thing is there wasnt just one mistake here. In this case it would appear that there was many mis-steps any one of which probably would have prevented the out come or at least minimized the odds of someone being struck by a bullet! There are just some mistakes you cant afford to make...to my way of thinking, this is one of them!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
302 Posts
1. The first question I have is why did knumb nuts have his handgun out of his holster anyways unless there was a threat that needed to be addressed. The guys a security guard at a retirement home and there is more action going on at the funeral home than there is there at 0110 in the morning. Just saying. That was mistake number 1.

2. The second mistake...was why did homey have the muzzle pointed in an unsafe direction? One of the first things of gun safety you should have been taught is all guns are loaded until other wise proven and you dont point them at ANYTHING you do not want to DESTROY, MAIM or KILL!

3. The third mistake was...If you were going to be an idiot and pull a loaded gun out of the holster, why was the safety off!!!

4. The forth mistake was...Unless you were about to shoot it why was your finger inside the trigger guard in the first place if you werent intending to discharge the gun in the first place?

5. The next mistake is...If you were going to play with your gun while on duty (or off for that matter) why didnt you first clear the gun so that crap like this didnt happen in the first place. Yeah I know that sounds too much like right. I like to carress and fondle my guns too but I aint stupid!!!

Anyone care to disagree with me? What are everyone elses thoughts on this subject?
No, I don't care to disagree with you. You are right on every way..........And if the truth be told, there is no telling what he was honestly doing when the gun discharged. He may have been striking a Charlie Angels pose and admiring his shadow...

My son was about 12 and let a 30-30 go off one day. He was letting the hammer back down, and the gun went off and shot a hole through the floor board of my husbands hunting rig. My husband who had stopped smoking for about 6 months promptly lit one up, and my son was Barney Fife'd again the rest of the season with a single shot shotgun and one shell in his pocket.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
855 Posts
I'd agree sounds more like a Negligent Discharge than an Accidental Discharge. To me an Accidental Discharge can only occur when there is a malfunction of the firearm (think stuck free floating firing pin), if it's operator error it's negligent. When I was a kid my father used to tell me if you handle guns long enough sooner or later one is going to go off when you don't want it too. This is why he used to hammer me about gun safety, he was a stickler about it for sure and it's definitely something that's stayed with me and is currently being drilled into my boys.

-Infidel
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,068 Posts
I had an "accidental discharge" once. I was staying in downtown San Francisco and one night there was a 5.1 earthquake. I discharged about 4 pounds directly into my shorts! (Yeah - you California guys can make fun of me all you want. In Minnesota, the ground is the one constant in an ever changing world.)

In regard to your coworker shooting himself, I put that down to nature trying to weed out the stupid...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,207 Posts
I haven't had any such problems but I carry with an empty chamber, it is hard to shoot yourself with an unloaded gun.
 
1 - 20 of 46 Posts
Top