I really like your forum here. So I decided to be a part of it
And here I am saying HELLO EVERYBODY!! :D
This is a discussion on In an emergency what do you really need? Family scenario within the Pistols and Revolvers forums, part of the HandGuns, Pistols and Revolvers, Long Rifles, Shotguns, SKS, AK, AR category; What do we really need? Firepower? Magnum power? Conceal-ability? Range? Much debate over what we would need if everything went kaflooey (like folks threatened to ...
Planning (destination, go bags etc)
What do we really need? Firepower? Magnum power? Conceal-ability? Range?
Much debate over what we would need if everything went kaflooey (like folks threatened to riot at the election, or in the weather disasters...?) In a protracted conflict with organized forces the needs are real different than a family staying safe or getting to safety.
I propose that firepower and military like rifles have an attraction but a limited value for a family scenario. The family must think about defending the homestead on one hand and immediate mobility on the other. The black utility rifles may be top gun for armies and protracted events, but the homestead and mobility change the tactical needs a bit. Any repeating shotgun, rifle, etc. is helpful around the home. Availability and weight is less of a problem. Remember that a family scenario is not a strike scenario nor is it one that pits the family against an organized force. That would be unlikely and a losing scenario. By the time an organized force gets to your neighborhood, you should have been long gone. Indeed. Leave the possession and save the people. A homestead event would usually mean an invasion by only a few who are "harvesting" the neighborhood or looking for something particular. Not unlike any home invasion scenario, aggressors are likely to flee when they know the family is capable of self defense. At that time is would be time to consider bugging out to a destination where a more organized defense is possible.
So... the big shoot out scenario may only mean that the end, for you, is near. Avoid that with diligence.
The family must be ready to leave without delay. Arms must be light and useable. Massive firepower is not likely to be needed when on the go. The main tactical concern should be 1. a destination and 2. stealth. Yep: run and hide. Look non-threatening (looking like an assassin or sniper is not good) and keep moving. Get to a destination, preplanned and stocked.
Suggestions: 1) Handguns you know how to use. Revolvers are great. If you know, in great detail and experience, an auto loader -- good.
Take the biggest caliber you can manage. 2) Rifles for the run: light and durable. I am not too interested in the sniper or decked out rail-gun with all the electronics. Guys are always messing with these things at the range while we get there and shoot and leave. 3) Decide how much ammo you need to carry. Too many varieties can be problematic. I like the revolver/rifle combo that use the same ammo. Do not carry too much. Stock it at your destination (covertly). Anecdote: a soldier who landed at Normandy and fought until the Battle of the Bulge said he was amazed at how little ammo he and the average soldier actually used. He was glad to have it, but did not need much of it and when they did they often used the stockpiled and delivered ammo rather than the "stash" in the bag. 4) Do not underestimate the value of camo blankets and jackets. Prepare to bed down with very little visibility. 5) Pack a first aid bag with common stuff and don't forget aspirin and Tylenol, and "joint wraps" (somebody always turns an ankle...)
The whole goal is NOT to shoot, NOT to be seen, NOT to panic and get to where you're going safely and in one piece.
This is VERY DIFFERENT FROM THE RED DAWN MOVIE. Do not let the movies get you and your family killed. If a movie is absolutely essential to your mind, think of the Von Trapps in Sound of Music. They hiked out to Switzerland without a fight.
Don't get others killed either by thinking you have to restore order. Get to the destination. Listen to your radio and gather data from your folks who join you. Hunker down until you know what is happening. Stay alive to re-establish freedom, faith and family.
God help the country if things go nuts.
I really like your forum here. So I decided to be a part of it
And here I am saying HELLO EVERYBODY!! :D
Interesting outlook though I don't agree on a few points, one being "military type" weapons not being for the family on the go. I'm not sure if you've humped an M16, M14 or other military weapon, but there not that heavy with a load out of mags once you get used to them and how hard it may be in the first place depends on the person. As for there usefulness, an AR15 which is the most popular semi automatic, civilian use in America rifle today is extremely useful for not only defense and offense, but taking a wide variety of game too. When shtf hard, it will be a much more dangerous world than it is now and this is a semi/full auto world in being the most common use firearms, not just revolvers anymore and bolt/lever actions. A family could run into real trouble and numbers fast when the world comes to that point and each person needs to think about what they'd rather have in their hands.
I'll take semi's any and every day. They do take a small understanding for the average user to know how to clean, lubricate and maintain, but I can and have taught that to even the most unfamiliar user in less than an hours time. The rest is just getting comfortable with them and practice. There's also commonality concerns if one wants to be concerned about it. 5.56x45mm/.223 is as far as I know the most common defensive rifle round today, next would be 7.62x51mm/.308. There used by militaries, police forces and heavily in citizens hands. You never know how long anything could last, what you may run out of, what you may need to trade for and than your firearms can always break too. Just something to think about.
Example: I live in Colorado. My BOB changes on an almost monthly basis depending on the weather and current events. I have snow goggles and ice cleats in my 72hr BOB half the year (and keep them in my long-term vehicle-based BOB the rest of the year). Do I need snow goggles in the summer? NO.... but that doesn't mean I don't have them handy just in case.
Some of us may not have the ability to go nor have a place to go that isn't over 1k miles. I have a place I could go in CO but at our age, we would not make it. Getting some place close by is not feasible at this time due to money issues. At this point I have no choice but to keep trying to figure the best way to defend family/friends and to keep them fed. I am on the outer fringe of a major metro area and figure I should be able to have some time to set up a defense. That's assuming it's a riot/financial collapse/takeover scenario. There are just too many different types of scenario's to be able to prep for all.
BTW even an old guy like me can tote an AR. Pretty light weight and easy to use.
Last edited by inceptor; 11-21-2012 at 04:55 PM.
I think a firearm is the most important. Obviously having a place to go is important, but if you have a firearm then you have power. If you don't have a firearm you would have to be able to lay low and get to your bug out location without being seen, otherwise if you come upon a person who has a a firearm, then you are in trouble. All I'm saying is it makes it a whole lot easier.
"Blessed is the one who reads aloud the words of this prophecy, and blessed are those who hear, and who keep what is written in it, for the time is near".
- Revelation 1:3
On the go I would take the AR-15 type of rifle for the following reasons,
1. Ammo weight: a 55 grain 5.56x45 weighs the same as a 115 grain 9mm bullet but has 3 times the energy.
2. The AR-15 is very rugged (the jamming is mostly a myth from years ago) the chrome barrel and parts will take a lot of abuse.
3. The most adaptable rifle as for as scopes, lights, and lasers that can be attached.
4. Complete parts kits are readily available.
5. Something not ever talked about is that a semi-auto can give you suppressive fire which can give you the ability to escape in a lot of scenario.
6. Anyone including a child can be trained quickly to use one when equipped with a red dot scope.
7. By removing 2 take down pin they can be broken down and carried in a backpack if you need to be inconspicuous and then quickly reassembled.
8. The flash suppressor will greatly reduce muzzle flash (necessary if using a 16 inch barrel and night).
9. The rifle chamber and 5.56 rnd was designed together to handle dirtier rounds then many hunting rifles.
10.They are designed to be able to fire a lot of rounds without getting to hot to hold.
Where are you right now and what do you have with you that is within arms reach. Folks if something happens it's going to be a come as you are event. Now, if you have no weapon with you right now, what are you going to do? BOB are a great thing to have, but if you can't get to your vehicle, the stuff in it is absolutey no good. But that small PPK or P3AT sized pistol in your back pocket, your pocket knife will do you a lot more good.
When I worked as a cop in a small town and commuted back and forth every three days to the farm, my vehicle had not only a bug out bag, but a patrol bag and a patrol shotgun
The hand gun is what all of my family are most likely to have on them at the minute things start falling a part if they are in town. The hand gun is just a path out to a bigger gun and better place of defense.
Best case news starts showing trouble in major cities, everyone knows to bail and head to safe house. Safe house will have better arms. You do not want to get in a gun fight with a hand gun.
It is to clear a path out the door ,to your car ect and get the heck away.
Side note we were at a large gathering to honor someones birthday a while back. Nice place out of town. Some how the subject of CC came up. A lady said "I don't understand why he had to push that No body really carries a gun around."
Being a like bit of a jerk I ask how many were carrying at that time. Even I was shocked, I expected 50%, she and the 80 year old women who we were honoring were the only ones not carrying.
And the birthday girl said she did need one everyone else has one.