All we have are witness' statements, but from what I heard, the man was cooperating and had his hands up when he was shot.
Not that I'm one to sympathize with an armed protest and "squatting" of property, but what were these idiots thinking when they transported BOTH group leaders AND one of the most outspoken members of this group IN THE SAME VEHICLE!
Who else here can spell "tactical mistake"?
With the Bundy's arrested, and "the voice" dead, the rest will disperse within a week.
If I am concealed carry or open carry legally.... why do you make a note that I am "ARMED PROTEST"
think about it... people are so TRAINED that they some how think that protesters with guns are SPECIAL or WORSE.... these guys were peaceful.... the unarmed ferguson protesters were the ones that destroyed millions of dollars worth of property
Death is a risk you assume when you defy the Federal leviathan. They have been putting down discontent with force for a long time. Shay's Rebellion and the Whiskey Rebellion were two of the earliest. Draft riots during the civil and Vietnam wars. Move in Philadelphia was bombed. A number of sides to all of this. Some unavoidable, others avoidable.
I don't know what they or everybody else expected but when you mess with the bull sometimes you get the horns. I'm all for the right of peaceful protest but an armed group seizing property that isn't theirs isn't a protest, its a criminal act. I think law enforcement has shown incredible restraint on all levels, until recently they didn't even have a perimeter set up.
I formulated an opinion on Ruby Ridge and Waco after a great deal of time reading arrest and search warrants, reading documents and researching both sides. One day I will have an opinion on this.
Here is my opinion... much thought should be given to an action that could very well take a mans life... A man's life is worth a great deal..not only to himself but to others.
locking a man in a cell for 5 years for a fire on government land that got out of control and killing a man for trespassing on federal land where nobody is getting hurt, selling a man an illegal shotgun and then raiding his compound,
here is my question
who was president during ruby ridge
who was president during waco
who was president during this
Frankly, if I was a federal law enforcement officer I would be ashamed... they can not get a case on Mrs Clinton but they can kill a rancher...
they can not round up illegal aliens but they can surround a farm for weeks
I tried to tell them to shut and go home..but do anybody ever listen to me? No. Prayers of comfort headed up for the family and friends of the dearly deceased person.
My wife's family owns sections and sections and sections of cattle and horse land in Montana. Her dad still owns part of the cattle operations and I imagine we will own that part of it some day
the federal gov owns 16 million acres and lease out about 8 million acres as range... the scary thing is who and how is the price set and what if they decide to back date cost or to stop grazing in order to protect the endangered wild red eye hildabest... if you think that there are federal people who care about farmers setting prices and making rules.. you are mislead....
frankly, IMHO the federal gov should own the land around DC and that is it.. all other land should be state owned.. and the fed should not be spending money to purchase more
My wife's family owns sections and sections and sections of cattle and horse land in Montana. Her dad still owns part of the cattle operations and I imagine we will own that part of it some day
the federal gov owns 16 million acres and lease out about 8 million acres as range... the scary thing is who and how is the price set and what if they decide to back date cost or to stop grazing in order to protect the endangered wild red eye hildabest... if you think that there are federal people who care about farmers setting prices and making rules.. you are mislead....
frankly, IMHO the federal gov should own the land around DC and that is it.. all other land should be state owned.. and the fed should not be spending money to purchase more
I am against our Federal (BLM-NFS) lands being turned over to the states. They would in short order, sell it off to Oil/Gas/ Developers or Wealthy friends/donors and we citizens would be on the outside looking in. Federal control isn't great, but State control is terrible.JMO
entering an unoccupied building without permission is not a violent crime. Trespassing is not a violent crime. Therefore it is still peaceful protest.
I contend as do they the federal building and the federal ownership of the land it is on is unconstitutional therefore entering the building or occupying the land is no crime at all. I am sure the corrupt legal/court system will charge and convict them of some obscure crime that does not open the question of the constitutionality of the federal land ownership to the jury.
I've read reports that Mr Finicum charged the police.
I wasn't there though.........but then again I'm not an idiot.
I guess if it turns out to be true, you guys could say that Mr Finicum had done nothing wrong and if Mr Finicum wanted to go jogging and head in the direction of the police then it's his right.
"What is that saying, don't believe 1/2 of what you read, a 1/3 of what you hear and none of what you see."
I have no reason to believe he charged the police. I wasn't there either and I have no reason to believe you are an idiot.
entering a any building and trespassing on someone else's property and being armed and telling the police you ain't taking me alive -well that could be considered a violent crime.
Every time an immigrant crosses our border in the middle of the night, they have committed a federal crime. Why is it that they are not arrested and sent back? Im not saying anything about what is happening up here in Oregon. But to the comment about they committed a federal crime so they should be arrested... Why not millions of ileagles?
oh thats right, Obummer only wants white conservitive people arrested for federal crimes
The bigger question is , Is this going to be the new norm? Are they going to be knocking in doors of gun owners who refuse to give up their arms in the middle of the night, Are they going to carrying of those who disagree with their politics this just shows that the American Government will MURDER its citizens overseas and now in America. I am afraid that they have crossed that line and will now become more common. Wonder how much money the greedy banks and their in the pocket politician will make off the next land deal and murders of more Americans. Cant expect to much though we do have a murderer running for President. Just my 2 cents worth.
It became the new norm at wounded knee, Ruby Ridge and Waco. None of those involved in any of the mention events were imprisoned and some were even promoted.
I just heard on the news they have arrested 3 more of the occupier that were leaving.
First off there will be all kinds of information that comes out by both sides. Until we have both sides and are able to wade through the BS to get the real story no one except the people involved really knows. Secondly I agree with Operator6, they didn’t follow the law of no guns on federal land, guess that makes me a sheep too. I agree with what they were trying to do, I think they just went about the wrong way. I don’t see the point of going back and forth about how someone’s perceive things that differ from another’s. That part of what makes this a great nation. People with different ideas that work together to get a common goal done. Another thing is when you get into name calling or posting pictures a douche to degrade someone is very childish. There is no reason to get into a “keyboard war” over this, a respectable debate is one thing, and this turned into something else. I’m just think back to the saying that I heard a lot when I was young “If you don’t have anything nice to say don’t say anything at all”. Lastly a man died and others are in jail, this will affect these people families. The LEO have a job to do and they did what they was ordered.
It's coming out that the Feds had information being provided to them from the inside.
A Benedict Arnold it would appear.
It's why I shun the Militias and focus on the III% movement as it was intended vs the Militia type groups that even some III%ers have created.
Sadly you just can't really trust people.... At least I don't.
I am not weighting in on their side nor am I taking the other.
I read everything I can on the topic but the hard facts are tough to come by.
Seems a lot of folks have their opinions !
Even the news outlets have varying takes on it and that's normal, but if I had to render my opinion on it I'd feel it would be based on less than all the facts and therefore possibly inaccurate.
But I will say, if you're going to stand with someone you stand with them all the way through.
Not sell them out for a better deal.
Should it ever come to the point that taking a life or death stand or even revolution is called for, ya gotta watch out for the snitches among you.
It's not just a Biker or Prison thing !
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