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Doing without now vs post SHTF

This is a discussion on Doing without now vs post SHTF within the General Prepper and Survival Talk forums, part of the Survivalist, Prepper, Bushcrafter, Forest Rangers category; Originally Posted by Real Old Man First you've never been in a real SHTF (like a civil war for 6 - 9 months) so all ...

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Thread: Doing without now vs post SHTF

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Real Old Man View Post
    First you've never been in a real SHTF (like a civil war for 6 - 9 months) so all you know is what you've read or seen here in the USofA

    Second no everyone is not going to die or become a looter.

    Society will not be pleasant, for some time, but it won't devolve into total anarchy in a matter of days.

    Germany didn't with the Collapse of the DM after WWI

    Nor Venezula today. Definitely not pleasant, but no whole sale slaughter or die offs

    Looting somewhat in South America, but to be expected

    Really you ought to put the key board down and get out and experience life in the real world for a change
    I tottally agree with you.
    Im starting to get into prepping because I worry about stuff like that, not really thinking about a zombie apocalypse or that bullshit even tho I do consider that some of those super apocalyptic scenaryos could happen, but less likely of course.
    Im from Argentina so I guess that you know that we have had lootings in the past years.
    I started getting afraid that we could be heading the venezuela road aswell, and thats not good at all.

    My country has many many problems, constant inflation, devaluation of our coin, everything gets more expensive every year and its been this way for decades, constant deficit year after year and a shitton of problems.
    So when u guys say that you're going throw a financial crysis I always found that really funny because from where I'm from things could go up in value from one day to the other and randomly I could run out of electricity for a week so the crysis in the US doesnt seems so bad hehe
    so the message im trying to send is dont over react and call everything a crysis because a lot more is needed to take down a country and society
    inceptor likes this.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by WhatTheHeck View Post
    It has been . . . suggested . . . there are few people who post good information.

    There has been some discussion about some tv show, calories in and calories out, the amount of physical activity in a post-SHTF situation.

    I own a small farm with small, medium and large livestock.

    I try to do everything around here as if the S has already HTF.
    About two years ago we got a early snow storm. The ATV got stuck in the snow. The last hog I had to put down for slaughter, I had to hump it out there with a plastic toboggan and haul the dead hog back.
    Upside, the snow made it somewhat easy to move.
    Downside, it was a good 400 or 500 yards hauling nearly 300lbs of dead weight.

    It is doable.

    Take a look around. See if there is anything you can do as if the S has HTF for a not only physical exercise, but mental one as well.
    I think this is a great post.

    I agree with, have said, and will continue to say that prepping without practical drills is very shaky at best. This is based on decades of experience. I was in a Boy Scout troop (yea, I know Boy Scouts, hahaha) that won every competition we ever engaged in, because we practiced. Before we went on a survival camp-out we would practice killing and skinning animals. Before we went on any campout we would pack, unpack, examine what we were taking and pack again better. The first TWO TIMES you do anything you have no clue what you are doing... and that's being generous. For some activities it takes 5+ times of doing the same thing before you figure out what's important or how to do it right.

    The Army was the same way. The first few times we did ANYTHING even with a manual it was a Cluster F***. After we got it down only regular repetition kept the skills sharp.

    The same with prepping. I wear a particular brand of underwear every day. It's the only brand I buy. Why? Because it's the only brand I've found that allows me the grab my BOB and Hike 5 miles without chafing. The only way to know that is to do it. If your question is "who cares about chafing?" it's because you don't actually walk miles a day with a pack for multiple days in a row. My original hiking boots had soles that were too slick walking on the edge of a blacktop road in the rain. There's no way I would have known that without that experience. If you are going cross country you may need wire cutters to get through a fence in an emergency. No way to know that. Gloves are incredibly important when hiking off trail. These are just lessons learned from "walking around" with a pack.

    There was a particular pair of "hiking pants" that were super high tech. I bought a pair from REI... within 75 miles of actual hiking they had blown out the crotch. I bought their "heavy duty" pair. Same thing but 60 miles of hiking. What do I hike in? SCRUBS. Hospital type scrubs. They are comfortable, light weight, don't require a belt, are cheap, small and easy to pack. The one I wear have pockets and even loops for other gear (because nurses carry gear too.) Scrub tops are very comfortable and well built. I often wear them, but they are hard to take off when they are soaked in sweat. They don't stretch. I still prefer them to more expensive exercise or outdoor clothes. Again, light, small, cheap, easy to pack. I can buy 10 of them and have them pre-packed in different bags for different situations. I couldn't do that with $600's worth of high tech camping or fishing shirts from Cabelas.

    There are hundreds of very important things you never learn without actually doing something. Most drills aren't that hard. Turn off the main breaker in your house and leave it off for 48 hours. Pack your car in 5 minutes then leave, don't come back for 5 days. You can only use what you packed. Grab your BOB and walk out of the house (in your work clothes). Do you have what you need to change into in your bag? It's 100 little things.

    I bought a 30 day supply of dehydrated "Emergency Food" and ate only it for a week. It gave me diarrhea and cramping. I hated it. That's why I don't keep it. If you keep "hard winter wheat" as your prep, grab a can and try to live on it for a few days. Do whatever you think you'll be doing with it.

    Go out in the woods and see how hard it is to actually find and shoot a squirrel. City squirrels are a dime a dozen and they sit there and stare at you. Country squirrels are much harder to find and shoot.

    None of these things are complicated. The start of this thread is a worthy question.

    So what do people actually do to test their preps?

    I hike with my BOB, eat my preps as part of my regular meals, do "power outage" drills, and do Bug outs with whatever is in my pack at the time - camping for a day or 3. Sometimes when I grab the pack I know I forgot to put something back or used something up and didn't replace it... I go with what's in the pack and suffer the consequences. I also regularly live in my "low energy" alternate 200 square foot "ARK." It's much more sustainable than the house in a long-term emergency. Plus I live at my BOL and practice gardening, building, etc.

    I see bad weather and think "What can I do outside right now?" The old Army phrase... If it's raining we're training.... Practicing in daylight, good weather at a camping site at a State Park is not the same as walking into a thunderstorm at midnight in your pajamas with your bugout bag. (You think you get to pick when the emergency will happen? Most happen in the shit.) The #1 things people forget after a few years of living in civilization is rain is wet, winter is cold and night is dark. I try to make sure I go out in the cold, rain and dark to test my gear and myself.


    Here's one I haven't done but I really need to do. Have my wife randomly call me when I'm out in my car. When she calls I need to park the car and get home with whatever I have available in the car. It'll probably teach me not to drive 10 miles away wearing only flip flops... or to keep hiking boots in my car. I just realized I don't have a change of clothes and shoes in my car. If I actually had to hike home it might end up being in sandals. Try hiking 5 miles in sandals. I need to buy an extra pair of boots for the car, and then hike in them until they are broken in. Good project for this week.

    or do a more planned emergency where I don't do any extra prep but I park my car at a state park and have to spend 3 days living out of whatever is in it. That's a good drill. I keep MRE's, Water adn some other stuff, but could I live on it for 3 days?

    An interesting one was camping on just what I could fit into the buttstock of a 22 rifle. That was a cold night. I did shoot a squirrel so I had something to eat - not much. My mastiff was with me. In the morning he showed up with a giant gash in his side from chasing off a wild boar. I was in the woods 500 feet from my house. I'm glad he was there I was sleeping on the ground. No tent, just a mylar bivybag.
    Last edited by tonybluegoat; 09-21-2018 at 10:10 AM.
    Gigio likes this.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by WhatTheHeck View Post
    It has been . . . suggested . . . there are few people who post good information.

    There has been some discussion about some tv show, calories in and calories out, the amount of physical activity in a post-SHTF situation.

    I own a small farm with small, medium and large livestock.

    I try to do everything around here as if the S has already HTF.
    About two years ago we got a early snow storm. The ATV got stuck in the snow. The last hog I had to put down for slaughter, I had to hump it out there with a plastic toboggan and haul the dead hog back.
    Upside, the snow made it somewhat easy to move.
    Downside, it was a good 400 or 500 yards hauling nearly 300lbs of dead weight.

    It is doable.

    Take a look around. See if there is anything you can do as if the S has HTF for a not only physical exercise, but mental one as well.
    Question on your experience. If you had it to do again would you section the hog and make multiple trips or still do in just one go?

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  5. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gigio View Post
    I tottally agree with you.
    Im starting to get into prepping because I worry about stuff like that, not really thinking about a zombie apocalypse or that bullshit even tho I do consider that some of those super apocalyptic scenaryos could happen, but less likely of course.
    Im from Argentina so I guess that you know that we have had lootings in the past years.
    I started getting afraid that we could be heading the venezuela road aswell, and thats not good at all.

    My country has many many problems, constant inflation, devaluation of our coin, everything gets more expensive every year and its been this way for decades, constant deficit year after year and a shitton of problems.
    So when u guys say that you're going throw a financial crysis I always found that really funny because from where I'm from things could go up in value from one day to the other and randomly I could run out of electricity for a week so the crysis in the US doesnt seems so bad hehe
    so the message im trying to send is dont over react and call everything a crysis because a lot more is needed to take down a country and society
    It seems for you stockpiling enough food to get through an inflationary period, food distribution problem would be #1. Creating a secure location for yourself and plans on how to defend or escape (for looting) might be #2. I don't know. What are your prepper priorities?

  6. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by tonybluegoat View Post
    I think this is a great post.

    I agree with, have said, and will continue to say that prepping without practical drills is very shaky at best. This is based on decades of experience. I was in a Boy Scout troop (yea, I know Boy Scouts, hahaha) that won every competition we ever engaged in, because we practiced. Before we went on a survival camp-out we would practice killing and skinning animals. Before we went on any campout we would pack, unpack, examine what we were taking and pack again better. The first TWO TIMES you do anything you have no clue what you are doing... and that's being generous. For some activities it takes 5+ times of doing the same thing before you figure out what's important or how to do it right.

    The Army was the same way. The first few times we did ANYTHING even with a manual it was a Cluster F***. After we got it down only regular repetition kept the skills sharp.

    The same with prepping. I wear a particular brand of underwear every day. It's the only brand I buy. Why? Because it's the only brand I've found that allows me the grab my BOB and Hike 5 miles without chafing. The only way to know that is to do it. If your question is "who cares about chafing?" it's because you don't actually walk miles a day with a pack for multiple days in a row. My original hiking boots had soles that were too slick walking on the edge of a blacktop road in the rain. There's no way I would have known that without that experience. If you are going cross country you may need wire cutters to get through a fence in an emergency. No way to know that. Gloves are incredibly important when hiking off trail. These are just lessons learned from "walking around" with a pack.

    There are hundreds of very important things you never learn without actually doing something. Most drills aren't that hard. Turn off the main breaker in your house and leave it off for 48 hours. Pack your car in 5 minutes then leave, don't come back for 5 days. You can only use what you packed. Grab your BOB and walk out of the house (in your work clothes). Do you have what you need to change into in your bag? It's 100 little things.

    I bought a 30 day supply of dehydrated "Emergency Food" and ate only it for a week. It gave me diarrhea and cramping. I hated it. That's why I don't keep it. If you keep "hard winter wheat" as your prep, grab a can and try to live on it for a few days. Do whatever you think you'll be doing with it.

    Go out in the woods and see how hard it is to actually find and shoot a squirrel. City squirrels are a dime a dozen and they sit there and stare at you. Country squirrels are much harder to find and shoot.

    None of these things are complicated. The start of this thread is a worthy question.

    So what do people actually do to test their preps?

    I hike with my BOB, eat my preps as part of my regular meals, do "power outage" drills, and do Bug outs with whatever is in my pack at the time - camping for a day or 3. Sometimes when I grab the pack I know I forgot to put something back or used something up and didn't replace it... I go with what's in the pack and suffer the consequences. I also regularly live in my "low energy" alternate 200 square foot "ARK." It's much more sustainable than the house in a long-term emergency. Plus I live at my BOL and practice gardening, building, etc.

    I see bad weather and think "What can I do outside right now?" The old Army phrase... If it's raining we're training.... Practicing in daylight, good weather at a camping site at a State Park is not the same as walking into a thunderstorm at midnight in your pajamas with your bugout bag. (You think you get to pick when the emergency will happen? Most happen in the shit.) The #1 things people forget after a few years of living in civilization is rain is wet, winter is cold and night is dark. I try to make sure I go out in the cold, rain and dark to test my gear and myself.


    Here's one I haven't done but I really need to do. Have my wife randomly call me when I'm out in my car. When she calls I need to park the car and get home with whatever I have available in the car. It'll probably teach me not to drive 10 miles away wearing only flip flops... or to keep hiking boots in my car. I just realized I don't have a change of clothes and shoes in my car. If I actually had to hike home it might end up being in sandals. Try hiking 5 miles in sandals. I need to buy an extra pair of boots for the car, and then hike in them until they are broken in. Good project for this week.

    or do a more planned emergency where I don't do any extra prep but I park my car at a state park and have to spend 3 days living out of whatever is in it. That's a good drill. I keep MRE's, Water adn some other stuff, but could I live on it for 3 days?

    An interesting one was camping on just what I could fit into the buttstock of a 22 rifle. That was a cold night. I did shoot a squirrel so I had something to eat - not much. My mastiff was with me. In the morning he showed up with a giant gash in his side from chasing off a wild boar. I was in the woods 500 feet from my house. I'm glad he was there I was sleeping on the ground. No tent, just a mylar bivybag.
    You sir are a bundle of energy. I agree testing gear and scenarios is a great learning experience. I can't seem to find the time to do half of what you do. Do you have kids? Any tips on how you fit all this in would be appreciated. I thought I was pretty good at multitasking and time management but you seem to have it down to a science. Good on you!

    Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
    Denton likes this.
    First you have to give up. First you have to know, not fear, know that someday you're going to die.

  7. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sasquatch View Post
    You sir are a bundle of energy. I agree testing gear and scenarios is a great learning experience. I can't seem to find the time to do half of what you do. Do you have kids? Any tips on how you fit all this in would be appreciated. I thought I was pretty good at multitasking and time management but you seem to have it down to a science. Good on you!

    Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
    It sounds like a lot, but when you put different experiences over 10 years in 1 post it gives a false reading. The short answer is, I don't watch TV. I have a TV but I have it set up in my art studio, not my house. So to watch TV I have to go to another building.

    My youngest is 21, so back up 10 years and she was 11, my oldest was 17 or 18 when I started prepping. It doesn't take 3 days to find out your are completely unprepared. I lived in the city, so "Hiking" meant grabbing my bug out bag when I got home from work (in work clothes) and then walking out of the house and down to the end of the dead end and climbing over a barbed wire fence into some guy's field... he didn't live there... no animals or anything, just a random field. I would find some woods and change my shoes to boots then head out. The goal was to stay off roads, walk back away from people and traffic. It's not that hard. Google maps will show you where creek beds and green belts are... transmission line routes, railroad tracks. I would "hike" 3 miles away from the house and then hike back. Go in the back yard and set up my BOL. The only rule is I couldn't go back in the house. The kids would come out if they wanted and eat an MRE with me or play campout.

    At night the kids are asleeep. Grab the bag and go for a round of hiking. Do not carry a gun, and carry good ID in case a cop wants to stop you. Tell him what you are doing. He will think you're an idiot and go on his way.

    Let's say I do the thing where my wife texts me and I have to walk home. It might take a couple hours and then she would drive me back to my car. Not a big deal. My kids are grown now. I guarantee my wife will wait until I'm least prepared to walk home before she calls. I will "learn my lesson" in just a few hours.

    Oh, and I work for myself. So I only actually work 2 days a week as a dog trainer. So for me every day is a holiday for the past 10 years. How can I do that? I decided to stop trying to "be rich." and moved to a 10 acre goat farm I bought for $50,000. I drive 10 year old cars that cost nothing and live on very little money. I make way more than I need, but I don't NEED to make much, so I'm free. I have a good wife.
    Last edited by tonybluegoat; 09-21-2018 at 10:29 AM.

  8. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by okey View Post
    honed them over 30 years ago. Now all I have to do is maintain

    Right, like the 3% of the population that's on active farms and ranches can do jack squat vs the 97% that are going to be forced to come to you, due to lack of water and food. Dream on, dude. Your neighbors and YOU buy your food at Wally's, just like everyone else does. Lots of people lie about that, but it's the fact of the matter. My family are all farmers and they shop at wally's like everyone else does. Having a garden is a labor of love. It's not a practical use of your time, and it's at high risk for losses, from pests, drought, fungi, etc. That's why almost nobody bothers. They dont have Mason jars or pressure cookers, all the garden seed is hybrid. if shtf, you're not going to have fertilizer, pesticides, etc, and yes, people WILL be shooting at you.
    Don't bet on that. You will come up short.
    New life as a house husband, major shift in duties.

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    After reading this Obama said I am on it.

  9. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by tonybluegoat View Post
    It sounds like a lot, but when you put different experiences over 10 years in 1 post it gives a false reading. The short answer is, I don't watch TV. I have a TV but I have it set up in my art studio, not my house. So to watch TV I have to go to another building.

    My youngest is 21, so back up 10 years and she was 11, my oldest was 17 or 18 when I started prepping. It doesn't take 3 days to find out your are completely unprepared. I lived in the city, so "Hiking" meant grabbing my bug out bag when I got home from work (in work clothes) and then walking out of the house and down to the end of the dead end and climbing over a barbed wire fence into some guy's field... he didn't live there... no animals or anything, just a random field. I would find some woods and change my shoes to boots then head out. The goal was to stay off roads, walk back away from people and traffic. It's not that hard. Google maps will show you where creek beds and green belts are... transmission line routes, railroad tracks. I would "hike" 3 miles away from the house and then hike back. Go in the back yard and set up my BOL. The only rule is I couldn't go back in the house. The kids would come out if they wanted and eat an MRE with me or play campout.

    At night the kids are asleeep. Grab the bag and go for a round of hiking. Do not carry a gun, and carry good ID in case a cop wants to stop you. Tell him what you are doing. He will think you're an idiot and go on his way.

    Let's say I do the thing where my wife texts me and I have to walk home. It might take a couple hours and then she would drive me back to my car. Not a big deal. My kids are grown now. I guarantee my wife will wait until I'm least prepared to walk home before she calls. I will "learn my lesson" in just a few hours.

    Oh, and I work for myself. So I only actually work 2 days a week as a dog trainer. So for me every day is a holiday for the past 10 years. How can I do that? I decided to stop trying to "be rich." and moved to a 10 acre goat farm I bought for $50,000. I drive 10 year old cars that cost nothing and live on very little money. I make way more than I need, but I don't NEED to make much, so I'm free. I have a good wife.
    Oh dont get me wrong I do plenty of hiking and scouting. I live in the city so I know you have to seek out any type of nature if you want it. However I do carry a gun when I go but I have a concealed carry permit so I'm not worried about that.

    I just find time my enemy (seems theres never enough of it).

    Cool you have an art studio. I am an artist as well. At least when time allows.

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  10. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sasquatch View Post
    Oh dont get me wrong I do plenty of hiking and scouting. I live in the city so I know you have to seek out any type of nature if you want it. However I do carry a gun when I go but I have a concealed carry permit so I'm not worried about that.

    I just find time my enemy (seems theres never enough of it).

    Cool you have an art studio. I am an artist as well. At least when time allows.

    Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
    Doing without now vs post SHTF-banner.jpg
    some of my stuff
    a little of everything from potter, printing, painting, etc.
    inceptor and Sasquatch like this.

  11. #30
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    Cool deal. Nice work.

    You mentioned you're a dog trainer. I considered being a dog trainer at one point. I train all my friends dogs for free so I figured maybe I'd try making some money at it. I never did it though. What kind of training do you do?

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